# Big Tech’s Big Bet on Trump  ## Episode metadata - Episode title: Big Tech’s Big Bet on Trump - Show: The Daily - Owner / Host: The New York Times - Guests: [Erin Griffith](https://share.snipd.com/person/07f9a43d-482e-41cb-9580-0d878754bbda) - Episode publish date: 2025-01-13 - Episode AI description: In a captivating discussion, Erin Griffith, a Technology reporter for The New York Times, dives into Silicon Valley's newfound support for Donald Trump. She details Marc Andreessen's shift from a Democratic donor to a Trump adviser, illuminating the region's changing political landscape. Griffith highlights tech leaders' strategic meetings with Trump and the implications for regulation, alongside the growing scrutiny of tech influence on democracy. She also explores the complex interplay of corporate philanthropy and political alliances shaping the future of the industry. - Duration: 32:22 - Episode URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/episode/043a9d49-df10-4583-bee0-b0c816f371dd) - Show URL: [Open in Snipd](https://share.snipd.com/show/d7988675-10e3-48d5-88a0-48a1a11749ec) - Export date: 2026-02-11T20:06:35 ## Snips ### [Big Tech's Support for Trump](https://share.snipd.com/snip/60749d85-e29f-49ec-b1c3-f57aeb1ab8d3) 🎧 00:43 - 01:14 (00:31) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/a8b00992-1513-422a-95e5-ff2f3e150f08" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Big tech companies are increasingly supporting Donald Trump, both as a candidate and president-elect. - This shift represents a notable change from Silicon Valley's historically liberal reputation. #### 💬 Quote > Big tech's biggest names are throwing their way behind Donald J. Trump in the biggest possible way, first as candidate and now as president-elect. > — Michael Barbaro Michael Barbaro on the shift in Big Tech's political support. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** Big tech's biggest names are throwing their way behind Donald Trump in the biggest possible way, first as candidate and now as president-elect. Today, what one tech billionaire's journey from top-tier Democratic donor to Trump advisor reveals about the growing moggification of Silicon Valley. --- ### [Silicon Valley's Political Shift](https://share.snipd.com/snip/eb082b6b-9597-467f-b5b4-c8647ebe8e4a) 🎧 02:37 - 03:00 (00:23) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/d3982afd-fb0f-429f-bf15-2352d3cc5bbd" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Open support for Trump has become more common in Silicon Valley, a significant change from the past. - Previously, expressing support for Trump or identifying as Republican was often taboo. - Trump's election victory has led to policy and personnel changes in the tech industry, signaling a growing acceptance of conservative viewpoints. #### 💬 Quote > In the past it may have been taboo or absolutely impossible to say that you supported Trump or even that you are Republican. Now, it's kind of a lot more common. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on the changing political climate in Silicon Valley. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** And that has a little bit of a trickle down effect where in the past it may have been taboo or absolutely impossible to say that you supported Trump or even that you are Republican. Now, it's kind of a lot more common. You encounter it a lot more frequently. And that's a huge change. And so once Trump won the election, we've seen the --- ### [Marc Andreessen's Political Shift](https://share.snipd.com/snip/ce68d5c5-6501-4058-8038-2ee548ae49b7) 🎧 05:00 - 06:18 (01:18) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/b068bb13-f4a7-43b7-ba0e-d5f0e6701f08" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen, a prominent Silicon Valley venture capitalist, has notably shifted his political allegiance. - A self-described "normie Democrat" who supported candidates from Bill Clinton to Hillary Clinton, Andreessen surprised many by supporting Trump in 2024. - Now, he's acting as a key advisor during Trump's transition, spending time at Mar-a-Lago and recommending tech industry figures for the administration. - This shift is emblematic of a larger cultural change within the tech industry. #### 💬 Quote > He's also called himself a quote unquote normie Democrat for most of his life. He supported all the way going back to Bill Clinton. [...] And so it was, you know, a little bit of a surprise when in 2024 he came out in support of Trump pretty loudly [...]. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on Marc Andreessen's political transformation. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** And the tech leader who maybe embodies this transformation the most is a venture capital investor named Marc Andreessen. **Michael Barbaro:** Well, tell us about Marc Andreessen and his shift. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah, so he's really a titan of Silicon Valley. He is the founder of a venture capital firm called Andreessen Horowitz that manages $44 billion. He has invested in some of the most prominent and successful startups to come out of Silicon Valley, know, Pinterest, Slack, Airbnb, Coinbase. He's on the board of Facebook. But more than that, he's kind of just like a VC thought leader who states his opinions very passionately. And the industry really follows and is influenced by what he says. He's also called himself a quote unquote normie Democrat for most of his life. He supported all the way going back to Bill Clinton. He supported Gore, Kerry, Obama, Hillary And so it was, you know, a little bit of a surprise when in 2024 he came out in support of Trump pretty loudly, donated money to the campaign. And now that Trump's about to take office, he's been kind of a key advisor in the transition. He's been spending a lot of time at Mar-a He's been recommending --- ### [Marc Andreessen: A Titan of Silicon Valley](https://share.snipd.com/snip/4bd84abe-7345-4fba-9b7e-cfec5c24af13) 🎧 05:00 - 05:13 (00:12) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/5e2cf50b-5611-4e25-b68b-80b7917fd612" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen, a venture capitalist, embodies the shift in Silicon Valley's political landscape. - He founded Andreessen Horowitz, a firm managing $44 billion, and has invested in successful startups like Pinterest, Slack, Airbnb, and Coinbase. - His influence and investments make him a key figure in the tech industry. #### 💬 Quote > The tech leader who maybe embodies this transformation the most is a venture capital investor named Marc Andreessen. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith explains how Marc Andreessen's actions reflect a shift in Silicon Valley. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** And the tech leader who maybe embodies this transformation the most is a venture capital investor named Marc Andreessen. **Michael Barbaro:** Well, tell us about Marc Andreessen and his shift. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah, so he's really --- ### [Marc Andreessen's Political Shift](https://share.snipd.com/snip/a357270f-0454-41f8-b9c9-4f49e1e113b7) 🎧 05:08 - 06:40 (01:31) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/8b2386fc-be07-49f4-a60c-803208fd453d" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen, a prominent venture capitalist, transitioned from being a Democratic donor to a Trump advisor. - He invested in major startups like Airbnb and Coinbase and sits on Facebook's board. #### 💬 Quote > Marc Andreessen [...] has invested in some of the most prominent and successful startups to come out of Silicon Valley, you know, Pinterest, Slack, Airbnb, Coinbase. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on Marc Andreessen's influence and investments. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** Well, tell us about Marc Andreessen and his shift. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah, so he's really a titan of Silicon Valley. He is the founder of a venture capital firm called Andreessen Horowitz that manages $44 billion. He has invested in some of the most prominent and successful startups to come out of Silicon Valley, know, Pinterest, Slack, Airbnb, Coinbase. He's on the board of Facebook. But more than that, he's kind of just like a VC thought leader who states his opinions very passionately. And the industry really follows and is influenced by what he says. He's also called himself a quote unquote normie Democrat for most of his life. He supported all the way going back to Bill Clinton. He supported Gore, Kerry, Obama, Clinton. And so it was, you know, a little bit of a surprise when in 2024 he came out in support of Trump pretty loudly, donated money to the campaign. And now that Trump's about to take office, he's been kind of a key advisor in the transition. He's been spending a lot of time at Mar-a He's been recommending people from the tech industry to work for the new administration. **Michael Barbaro:** So how does Andreessen go from reliable, normie Democrat to and now advisor to Donald Trump. **Erin Griffith:** For Andreessen, it starts with this concept that he calls the deal. Marc Andreessen, welcome to Honestly. --- ### [The Deal](https://share.snipd.com/snip/7945ede2-3706-475c-8174-f1f029cf5ee5) 🎧 06:40 - 08:35 (01:55) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/85db006e-27b1-471b-bdb8-e75da816a7a9" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen's "deal" philosophy suggests that business success should be celebrated and philanthropy absolves sins. - This deal involves making money, giving it away, and being celebrated, while being left alone to innovate. #### 💬 Quote > The deal was somebody like me basically could start a company. [...] Everybody would think that that was great. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen explaining his 'deal' philosophy. #### 📚 Transcript **Marc Andreessen:** It's great to be here. **Erin Griffith:** I'm really happy to have you. And he's talked about this on a number of podcasts, including Barry Weiss's and Joe Rogan's. And **Marc Andreessen:** what's the deal? The deal was somebody like me basically could start a company. You can invent a new technology. In this case, you know, web browsers and all the other things that Netscape did. Everybody would think that that was great. The deal **Erin Griffith:** is that you could be a successful business person and you get celebrated for your innovations or your business success. You get celebrated for making lots of money. And then at the end, you give it all away and you are further celebrated for that. That **Marc Andreessen:** washes away all of your sins. **Erin Griffith:** You know, the idea sort of is you will thank us. **Marc Andreessen:** You get invited to all the great parties. You get invited to Davos. You get invited to Aspen. You get to come in and sit with the New York Times editorial board. And **Erin Griffith:** you will mostly leave us alone and let us innovate. **Marc Andreessen:** And that's the arc and it's all great and wonderful. **Erin Griffith:** This is kind of the philosophy that his whole career has operated by. He found success at a really young age. He was the co-founder of this iconic early internet company called Netscape. He made a lot of money and went on to be a very successful venture capital investor after that. He was thinking like, this is great. I'm doing great things for the world and the world is going to thank me for it. His political views kind of reflected that as well. He was a big fan of Obama. He even wrote an op-ed about his choice to support him. And part of it was that he personally liked Obama. He called him smart, normal, curious, not radical, post-boomer. He was a fan. But, you know, in his view, the deal kind of started to break down toward the end of the Obama years. --- ### [Marc Andreessen's 'The Deal'](https://share.snipd.com/snip/5ccfa122-184f-443d-a6a1-ee412f27359e) 🎧 06:47 - 07:09 (00:21) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/45ce0eab-c920-48a1-8211-a203a8db1bae" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen describes 'the deal' as the traditional path for successful tech entrepreneurs. - It involves innovating, building successful businesses, making lots of money, and ultimately giving it all away. - This philanthropic act, according to Andreessen, earns further celebration and washes away any perceived 'sins' of wealth accumulation. - It grants access to elite circles and events like Davos. #### 💬 Quote > The deal was somebody like me basically could start a company. You can invent a new technology. [...] Everybody would think that that was great. [...] you could be a successful business person and you get celebrated for your innovations or your business success. You get celebrated for making lots of money. And then at the end, you give it all away and you are further celebrated for that. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen on his concept of 'the deal' #### 📚 Transcript **Marc Andreessen:** what's the deal? The deal was somebody like me basically could start a company. You can invent a new technology. In this case, you know, web browsers and all the other things that Netscape did. Everybody would think that that was great. The deal **Erin Griffith:** is that you could be a successful business person and you get celebrated for your innovations or your business success. --- ### [Breaking the Deal](https://share.snipd.com/snip/2f4d1e2d-b767-46df-a3f5-c82afb735e81) 🎧 08:35 - 10:51 (02:16) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/7096bb52-eaed-4177-b42f-1eca4ab88a7a" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen believes the "deal" broke down due to increasing criticism of tech's growing influence. - The criticism targets privacy concerns, labor practices, and the overall power of tech companies. #### 💬 Quote > And the tech industry was not used to being criticized about privacy, about labor practices. They really didn't like it. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on the increasing criticism faced by the tech industry. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** There's no doubt the sharing economy is disrupting traditional businesses. A little context that's kind of helpful for understanding this, you know, in the middle of the 2010s, tech as an industry was going from this kind of quirky niche thing that was happening to an extremely powerful and bigger than ever part of our lives and our economy. **Marc Andreessen:** Well, it's just hard to compete with the ease of online shopping. don't even have to leave my cubicle to find great deals all over the Internet. It is a much different experience than actually going to a store. Amazon **Erin Griffith:** is disrupting retail. Let's look at Airbnb for one. Startups are disrupting taxis and hotels. Taxi drivers angry and frustrated that Uber and Lyft drivers are taking their business while escaping the expensive regulations taxis face. There are these major changes happening and the tech industry is kind of ascendant. But when that happens, you know, it brings a lot of criticism, too. More **Marc Andreessen:** and more, these large companies and their power is a threat to democracy. And **Erin Griffith:** the tech industry was not used to being criticized about privacy, about labor practices. They really didn't like it. so one moment that really encapsulates that for him is something that happened in 2015 with Mark Zuckerberg and his wife Priscilla Chan when they announced that they were going to donate most of their net worth to charity. And **Marc Andreessen:** so they did this thing where they announced and committed that 99 percent of their ownership in Facebook was going to go to philanthropic causes. **Erin Griffith:** This is, you know, following the classic deal trajectory, right? And they just got hammered **Marc Andreessen:** with criticism and attacks on that. **Erin Griffith:** But instead of getting the praise and adoration that they expected, they actually got a lot of criticism for the structure that they chose to give the money away in, the way that they were doing it. People were kind of picking it apart. And **Marc Andreessen:** the line of argument was literally, oh, they're just slimy rich people and they're only doing it for the tax break, which is like a basic mathematical problem, which is you don't give away 99 percent of your money for a tax break. **Erin Griffith:** To Andreessen and his telling, this really kind of encapsulated for him the beginning of his shift in perspective on basically everything. --- ### [Zuckerberg Charity Backlash](https://share.snipd.com/snip/62b10a43-f102-4efd-92fe-b2ac95fcb671) 🎧 09:41 - 10:16 (00:35) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/aa7bf74f-0791-4fd4-a288-b5c3095bc3a3" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - In 2015, Mark Zuckerberg and Priscilla Chan pledged to donate most of their Facebook ownership to charity. - Instead of praise, they received criticism for the donation's structure. - People accused them of seeking tax breaks, despite the mathematical improbability. - Marc Andreessen saw this as a turning point, where tech's contributions were no longer appreciated. #### 💬 Quote > So they did this thing where they announced and committed that 99 percent of their ownership in Facebook was going to go to philanthropic causes. [...] they just got hammered with criticism and attacks on that. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen on the public reaction to Zuckerberg's charity pledge. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** They really didn't like it. so one moment that really encapsulates that for him is something that happened in 2015 with Mark Zuckerberg and his wife Priscilla Chan when they announced that they were going to donate most of their net worth to charity. And **Marc Andreessen:** so they did this thing where they announced and committed that 99 percent of their ownership in Facebook was going to go to philanthropic causes. **Erin Griffith:** This is, you know, following the classic deal trajectory, right? And they just got hammered **Marc Andreessen:** with criticism and attacks on that. **Erin Griffith:** But instead of getting the praise and adoration that they expected, they --- ### [Zuckerberg's Philanthropy Backlash](https://share.snipd.com/snip/9956c8df-5dcb-4fd7-865d-f791911e3fc8) 🎧 10:51 - 12:18 (01:26) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/147ff861-0128-4b52-9fa0-fc27661d0617" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Mark Zuckerberg and Priscilla Chan's philanthropy faced criticism for its structure, not just praise. - Andreessen saw this as a turning point, questioning the prevailing narrative around tech's role in society. #### 💬 Quote > But instead of getting the praise and adoration that they expected, they actually got a lot of criticism for the structure that they chose to give the money away in [...] > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on the backlash faced by Zuckerberg and Chan's philanthropy. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** Basically, **Marc Andreessen:** what I experienced was they, the people in charge of all this, basically broke the deal. So basically, every single thing I just said for the last decade has been now held to be presumptively evil. Tech people are held to be this evil class. Anybody who's rich is evil. Philan was being redefined as evil it's like okay every single part of that deal no longer works and so it just you know for me it then raised the question of like okay if none of that is true then what world am i living in what role do i play **Michael Barbaro:** So in his mind, the deal had been honored for much of the history of Silicon Valley and much of his own very successful career until suddenly people start to, as you said, pick apart, question, challenge everything about the people who are at the center of the deal, these entrepreneurs, these founders, people like Mark Zuckerberg. And suddenly they can only do wrong. Exactly. **Erin Griffith:** He has kind of described this as a little bit of a journey of him asking himself, like, what's happening here? And that was really compounded by the election of Donald Trump in 2016. He talked about how it really took him by surprise and he realized he didn't understand what was happening in the country and he needed to go on his own kind of political awakening and figure out what was driving this. And --- ### [Russiagate and Tech Scapegoating](https://share.snipd.com/snip/03170053-fd62-47c4-84df-a011be78270f) 🎧 12:18 - 14:16 (01:57) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/4a45bc80-3e60-418d-96c1-f6300b9f2bff" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen felt tech was scapegoated for Russian interference in the 2016 election, despite U.S. intelligence confirming it. - He viewed this as an example of misplaced blame and further fueled his disillusionment. #### 💬 Quote > And Hillary gets up there and she says, Trump is only president today because Vladimir Putin hacked Facebook and made him the president. Right. And I'm sitting in the audience and I'm like on the Facebook board. And I'm like, that's not like that's not true. I know for an absolute fact that that's not true. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen expressing his skepticism about the narrative surrounding Russian interference. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** what does that awakening look like and what does he find? Well, **Erin Griffith:** you know, after the 2016 election, the tech companies came under a lot of scrutiny from both sides. so kind of while he's doing this inquiry, he's trying to kind of learn about what's actually going on in America. We have these allegations made by U.S. intelligence that Russia had basically hijacked platforms like Facebook and used them to meddle in the U.S. election. So Andreessen, you know, has a front row seat to this. He's on Facebook's board. **Marc Andreessen:** I went to Hillary's first post-election loss speech, which she gave at Stanford. And the Russiagate stuff is in full, full-blown, full-blown display. And Hillary gets up there and she says, Trump is only president today because Vladimir Putin hacked Facebook and made him the president. Right. And I'm sitting in the audience and I'm like on the Facebook board. And I'm like, that's not like that's not true. I know for an absolute fact that that's not true. And **Erin Griffith:** he felt like it didn't add up and that people were just scapegoating the tech companies. Right. **Marc Andreessen:** And so that got me thinking. And then the Russiagate stuff unspooled. And I was like, it was just this litany of, you know, basically excuses and complaints. Right. With no sense of like responsibility, personal responsibility at all. **Erin Griffith:** Ultimately, you know, U.S. intelligence concluded that Russia did interfere by using social media platforms. And Facebook set up an oversight board to start monitoring this stuff. And, **Marc Andreessen:** you know, they're trying to run a business. They're trying to get to the next quarter. They're trying to keep the employee base and everybody copacetic. They're trying not to get just completely destroyed by the politicians. **Erin Griffith:** Andreessen is still a little bit concerned about the direction that things are going. He views it as a slippery slope that, you know, tracking things like hate speech, moderating things is a road to censorship. And so he kind of concludes that the oversight is going a little bit too far. And then Joe Biden gets elected, which in his mind accelerates all the problems that he saw already unfolding in the tech industry. How --- ### [Marc Andreessen's Skepticism of Russiagate Allegations](https://share.snipd.com/snip/1d97e466-b8bb-4baf-b4a3-dd6b7dba2c03) 🎧 12:50 - 14:41 (01:50) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/532189cf-8299-4cad-b8c2-c02ade013355" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen attended Hillary Clinton's post-election speech at Stanford, where she attributed Trump's victory to Russian interference on Facebook. - As a Facebook board member, Andreessen knew this wasn't entirely accurate and felt tech companies were being scapegoated. - This experience, along with the subsequent unfolding of the Russiagate investigation, led Andreessen to question the prevailing narrative. #### 💬 Quote > Hillary gets up there and she says, Trump is only president today because Vladimir Putin hacked Facebook and made him the president. Right. And I'm sitting in the audience and I'm like on the Facebook board. And I'm like, that's not like that's not true. I know for an absolute fact that that's not true. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen on Hillary Clinton blaming Facebook for Trump's election win #### 📚 Transcript **Marc Andreessen:** I went to Hillary's first post-election loss speech, which she gave at Stanford. And the Russiagate stuff is in full, full-blown, full-blown display. And Hillary gets up there and she says, Trump is only president today because Vladimir Putin hacked Facebook and made him the president. Right. And I'm sitting in the audience and I'm like on the Facebook board. And I'm like, that's not like that's not true. I know for an absolute fact that that's not true. And **Erin Griffith:** he felt like it didn't add up and that people were just scapegoating the tech companies. Right. **Marc Andreessen:** And so that got me thinking. And then the Russiagate stuff unspooled. And I was like, it was just this litany of, you know, basically excuses and complaints. Right. With no sense of like responsibility, personal responsibility at all. **Erin Griffith:** Ultimately, you know, U.S. agencies concluded that Russia did interfere by using social media platforms. And Facebook set up an oversight board to start monitoring this stuff. And, **Marc Andreessen:** you know, they're trying to run a business. They're trying to get to the next quarter. They're trying to keep the employee base and everybody copacetic. They're trying not to get just completely destroyed by the politicians. **Erin Griffith:** Andreessen is still a little bit concerned about the direction that things are going. He views it as a slippery slope that, you know, tracking things like hate speech, moderating things is a road to censorship. And so he kind of concludes that the oversight is going a little bit too far. And then Joe Biden gets elected, which in his mind accelerates all the problems that he saw already unfolding in the tech industry. How **Michael Barbaro:** so? Well, **Erin Griffith:** especially during the pandemic, the Biden administration put a lot of pressure on Facebook to suppress things like the lab leak theory of how COVID started. At one point, Biden accused the social media platforms of killing people by allowing disinformation on the vaccines to flourish. **Michael Barbaro:** Right. And I remember Facebook in particular took that very personally and they were upset about it. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah. And --- ### [Biden Administration's Stance on Tech](https://share.snipd.com/snip/6aa7f1ae-bf4f-4509-bc14-fac3d9de8e7f) 🎧 14:16 - 15:57 (01:40) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/bbaef45b-57ef-438b-91ab-70e5180aaf3b" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen saw the Biden administration's pressure on Facebook to suppress certain information as overreach. - Biden's appointments of Lina Khan and Gary Gensler to regulatory roles further solidified this perception. #### 💬 Quote > - [...] especially during the pandemic, the Biden administration put a lot of pressure on Facebook to suppress things like the lab leak theory of how COVID started. [...] And, you know, they're going after big tech for antitrust. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith explaining Andreessen's view on the Biden administration's approach to tech. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** so? Well, **Erin Griffith:** especially during the pandemic, the Biden administration put a lot of pressure on Facebook to suppress things like the lab leak theory of how COVID started. At one point, Biden accused the social media platforms of killing people by allowing disinformation on the vaccines to flourish. **Michael Barbaro:** Right. And I remember Facebook in particular took that very personally and they were upset about it. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah. And just to add a little bit of context, Democrats have historically had a very tight relationship with the tech industry, and Joe Biden did not. And, you know, among the first things that Biden does is he appoints two people that the tech industry really does not like to key regulatory roles. That's Lena Kahn as the head of FTC, Gary Gensler at the SEC. And, you know, they're going after big tech for antitrust. That hurts mergers and acquisitions and the ability of some of Andreessen's portfolio companies to get bought. Gary Gensler is going after the crypto industry, and that hurts a lot of the companies that Andreessen Horowitz has invested in. They're one of the biggest crypto investors. And so the Biden administration really takes this kind of antagonistic view toward tech. And a lot of people in the tech industry bristled at that. So **Michael Barbaro:** at first, he's watching with some alarm as tech companies, primarily from the left, are being pushed toward a form of what he regards as censorship. And then he's watching as a new administration comes in that, based on its appointments, seems outright hostile to big tech's business interests. --- ### [Disagreement on AI Regulation](https://share.snipd.com/snip/1f9605e9-b8c1-4380-909d-a13486707fd7) 🎧 15:57 - 18:33 (02:36) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/b64a9f49-96b8-4ae7-9a8b-c29344a14409" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen felt the Biden administration aimed to control AI, discouraging investment in AI startups. - He viewed this as a hostile act against tech innovation and progress. #### 💬 Quote > They basically said AI is going to be controlled by the government. Don't fund AI startups. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith summarizing Andreessen's interpretation of the meeting with Biden's administration. #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** Absolutely. And this all sort of culminates in this meeting that happened last May. Andreessen and a lot of other tech people met with Biden's people to talk about AI. And he basically comes away with the view that the Democrats are not just trying to control speech, but they're trying to control Silicon Valley. They're trying to control technology. **Marc Andreessen:** We had meetings in D.C. in May where we talked to them about this, and the meetings were absolutely horrifying. **Erin Griffith:** According to Andreessen, Biden's people basically came in and took a very antagonistic view of AI and how to regulate it. They **Marc Andreessen:** said, look, AI is a technology basically that the government is going to completely control. This is not going to be a startup thing. They basically said AI is going to be a game of two or three big companies working closely with the government. **Erin Griffith:** They essentially said AI is going to be controlled by the government. Don't fund AI startups. This is his characterization. Other people who were there, including Sam Altman, the CEO of OpenAI, disputes that characterization, says maybe it's a little exaggerated. And **Marc Andreessen:** then I said, I don't understand how you're going to lock this down so much because like the math for, you know, AI is like out there and it's being taught everywhere. And, you know, the **Erin Griffith:** overall takeaway from Andreessen was that this is going to be a hostile fight between government regulators who want to clamp down on the technology that he and the companies that he invests in want to build. **Marc Andreessen:** And you have this like incredibly radicalized, you know, set of policies with this young staff that just is like out for blood on all these different fronts. **Erin Griffith:** And so this is when he basically concludes that Biden is anti-tech. He views the administration and by extension Democrats as radical on tech innovation and tech progress, which is kind of his life's work. So all of this together really primes him to be courted by the other side. When **Marc Andreessen:** you leave a meeting like that, what do you do? You go endorse Donald Trump. --- ### [Dinner at Bedminster](https://share.snipd.com/snip/b22e9f0e-113f-46ad-9a29-eb3e510b0f1a) 🎧 20:07 - 23:21 (03:14) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/c0e6d7b0-edef-498c-917a-f56d5c623560" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Trump impressed Andreessen and Ben Horowitz during a dinner at Bedminster, discussing his pro-tech vision. - Trump emphasized his desire for American tech companies to win, beating China and creating jobs. #### 💬 Quote > His thing with us basically was like, look, I just want America to win. [...] You guys should go build tech companies. The American tech companies should win. > — Marc Andreessen Marc Andreessen recounting his conversation with Trump. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** talk about this courtship from the other side, because so far, what you're describing from Mark Andreessen is really a deepening frustration with the left, with the Biden administration, rather than any kind of deep kinship with Donald Trump. **Erin Griffith:** Yeah. And, you know, on July 5th, he posted this manifesto, which is something that he does from time to time. He's got some really famous ones, including Software is Eating the World and It's Time to Build. He posts one that is called the Little Tech Agenda. He basically concludes that, you know, big tech companies have lobbyists that are kind of looking out for them, but no one's sticking up for what he calls Little Tech. And that includes all the startups and the venture firms that he's working with. And he basically says, Andreessen Horowitz, the venture capital firm, is going to support any candidate that supports the little tech agenda. And so that's kind of like opening the door for like, hey, you know, any presidential candidate, any congressional candidate that wants to, you know, kind of win our vote and our support, like, tell us what you got. And they tried to meet with both Biden and Trump. They never ended up meeting with Biden, but Trump invited them to dinner. **Marc Andreessen:** So we met with him at his Bedminster golf club in New Jersey, which is like breathtaking. Absolutely beautiful. **Erin Griffith:** Mark Andreessen and his partner, Ben Horowitz, end up at Trump's golf club in New Jersey, Bedminster. **Marc Andreessen:** Yeah, I mean, he's just, he's an incredible host. You know, he runs his own private worlds. **Erin Griffith:** And they're super impressed by Trump. He **Marc Andreessen:** said, what do you guys want to eat? And I just, I, for some reason, I was just like, I know exactly what to say. And I'm like, meat, I want meat. **Erin Griffith:** And **Marc Andreessen:** it was glorious. **Erin Griffith:** Andreessen talks about how Trump only ordered meat and how he wined and dined them. It's **Marc Andreessen:** also one of the really interesting, we'll kind of watch him at work, which is he treats everybody the same and he talks to everybody. He will happily talk to distinguished visitors about like, you know, who the vice president should be. And then he'll ask the caddy. They **Erin Griffith:** talk about how Trump talks to everyone. You know, he's really kind of in the mix. His **Marc Andreessen:** thing with us basically was like, look, I just want America to win. He's **Erin Griffith:** telling them kind of exactly what they want to hear. You know, **Marc Andreessen:** you guys are in tech. I don't know much about tech, but I don't need because you guys know a lot about it. You guys should go build tech companies. The American tech companies should win. He **Erin Griffith:** wants America to win and he wants tech to win. We **Marc Andreessen:** should beat China. We should export. We should make the products the world wants. Our economy should be growing a lot faster. We should be creating a lot more jobs. You know, everybody in America who wants a good job should have one. And that will be the result of, you know, American companies succeeding. He **Erin Griffith:** wants to do what he can to help tech companies thrive. And he wants government to get out of the way. And he wants American innovation to be exported all around the world. **Marc Andreessen:** And so, you know, and most of the discussion was just around that. And so they were really taken **Erin Griffith:** with Trump and his message to them. **Michael Barbaro:** Right. It sounds like what he's telling Andreessen, and it sounds like Andreessen wants to hear it, is that Trump is prepared to restore the deal, as Andreessen would call it. You do your thing. I'm here to cheer you on and celebrate and help. **Erin Griffith:** Exactly. So --- ### [Andreessen Horowitz Meets Trump](https://share.snipd.com/snip/744ac1de-e7b0-4b65-9252-882c89bc19c0) 🎧 20:31 - 22:06 (01:35) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/88d39fa4-169b-46da-9644-28a358d21f5c" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Marc Andreessen published "The Little Tech Agenda", advocating for startups and venture firms. - Andreessen Horowitz offered support to any candidate backing this agenda, attempting to meet with both Biden and Trump. - Trump invited them to dinner at his Bedminster golf club. - Andreessen and Horowitz were impressed by Trump's hospitality, describing him as an "incredible host" who "runs his own private worlds". - Trump's message resonated with them, stating, "I just want America to win." #### 💬 Quote > He's got some really famous ones, including "Software is Eating the World" and "It's Time to Build". He posts one that is called the "Little Tech Agenda". > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on Marc Andreessen's manifestos #### 📚 Transcript **Erin Griffith:** He's got some really famous ones, including Software is Eating the World and It's Time to Build. He posts one that is called the Little Tech Agenda. He basically concludes that, you know, big tech companies have lobbyists that are kind of looking out for them, but no one's sticking up for what he calls Little Tech. And that includes all the startups and the venture firms that he's working with. And he basically says, Andreessen Horowitz, the venture capital firm, is going to support any candidate that supports the little tech agenda. And so that's kind of like opening the door for like, hey, you know, any presidential candidate, any congressional candidate that wants to, you know, kind of win our vote and our support, like, tell us what you got. And they tried to meet with both Biden and Trump. They never ended up meeting with Biden, but Trump invited them to dinner. **Marc Andreessen:** So we met with him at his Bedminster golf club in New Jersey, which is like breathtaking. Absolutely beautiful. **Erin Griffith:** Mark Andreessen and his partner, Ben Horowitz, end up at Trump's golf club in New Jersey, Bedminster. **Marc Andreessen:** Yeah, I mean, he's just, he's an incredible host. You know, he runs his own private worlds. **Erin Griffith:** And they're super impressed by Trump. He **Marc Andreessen:** said, what do you guys want to eat? And I just, I, for some reason, I was just like, I know exactly what to say. And I'm like, meat, I want meat. **Erin Griffith:** And **Marc Andreessen:** it was glorious. **Erin Griffith:** Andreessen talks about how Trump only ordered meat and how he wined and dined them. It's **Marc Andreessen:** also one of the really interesting, we'll kind of watch him at work, which is he treats everybody the same and he talks to everybody. He will happily talk to distinguished visitors about like, you know, who the vice president should be. And then he'll ask the caddy. --- ### [Endorsement of Trump](https://share.snipd.com/snip/85bc5687-a39e-4176-b7c3-a8914eb6f47f) 🎧 23:21 - 24:55 (01:34) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/99956949-b43e-49e9-95d4-0dd2d13f8e94" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen and Horowitz endorsed Trump, citing his pro-tech stance and admiration for his response to the assassination attempt. - This endorsement emboldened other Trump supporters in Silicon Valley to voice their support publicly. #### 💬 Quote > Shortly after that, Andreessen and Horowitz post a podcast announcing that they are endorsing Trump for president. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on Andreessen and Horowitz's public endorsement of Trump. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** what ends up happening after this dinner at Bedminster? **Erin Griffith:** Shortly after that, Andreessen and Horowitz post a podcast announcing that they are endorsing Trump for president. They went into a lot of the stuff that we've been talking about, you know, the pressure to moderate content online, the regulation, the fact that Trump is eager to the tech industry innovate and build and do all the things they want to do. And there was one other reason. I think it's hard **Marc Andreessen:** for any man to see somebody get shot in the head, bleeding, not knowing how badly he's been injured. **Erin Griffith:** They really talked about how impressed they were by the fact that he, you know, raised his fist after the assassination attempt. And **Marc Andreessen:** put your fist up in the air and say, fight, fight, fight. How cool they thought that was. We don't see physical bravery like that. **Erin Griffith:** All of these things combined result in their endorsement. And that's really the start of when a lot of people who were maybe privately supporting Trump in Silicon Valley really started to come out of the woodwork and say so publicly. **Michael Barbaro:** So Andreessen creates something of a permission structure for others in the Valley to say, I too support Trump. **Erin Griffith:** Absolutely. Andreessen and Elon Musk and a few other leaders combined. I mean, Elon's endorsement was obviously really influential, but within the tech industry, specifically venture capital and startups, you know, Mark his opinion really carries a lot of weight. And I think that did open the door for a lot of people to come out as Trump supporters as well. --- ### [Trump's Gains in Silicon Valley](https://share.snipd.com/snip/36431b07-a74c-419d-b788-1dedad460828) 🎧 24:55 - 26:08 (01:12) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/0788cc0d-31ec-4fa2-8a77-aef1e947dac6" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Trump's appeal in Silicon Valley stems from his perceived alignment with tech's cultural and financial interests. - This marks a shift in the political landscape of the tech industry. #### 💬 Quote > - [...] I hadn't really thought of it as an election in which he had also made gains in the constituency of Silicon Valley. But that is clearly one of the places that he made very unexpected inroads. > — Michael Barbaro Michael Barbaro on Trump's unexpected success in gaining support from Silicon Valley. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** In thinking about the story that you have told here and the journey that Marc Andreessen has gone on, it's pretty clear that there are two major elements here. One is that in his mind, Democratic Party failed him and failed tech, both culturally and financially. And the second component is that Trump, in his mind, meets the tech industry where it is, culturally and financially. And in that sense, it's just not all that complicated. But what stands out, to me at least, is that this ends up being the story of the Democratic Party seeming to forfeit what had been a very long and seemingly fruitful relationship with these innovators and leaders of tech. And when we think about the result of the 2024 election, I think quite naturally, you know, we think about the fact that the vote went to Trump and that once again, he made all these gains in various constituencies. I hadn't really thought of it as an election in which he had also made gains in the constituency of Silicon Valley. But that is clearly one of the places that he made very unexpected inroads. --- ### [Tech's Influence in the Trump Administration](https://share.snipd.com/snip/224ee0d6-236e-477a-9bbe-9a8c81630e0a) 🎧 26:49 - 28:27 (01:38) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/81baf685-c64f-416c-a727-fd8003055e47" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Tech figures are actively seeking influence in the Trump administration, reminiscent of the Obama era. - Multiple Andreessen Horowitz partners have joined the administration, and many tech workers are seeking involvement. #### 💬 Quote > - [...] two Andreessen Horowitz partners have already been appointed to join the administration. [...] You see a new post on social media every day of some prominent tech person heading over to Mar-a to meet and try and get on one of these advisory boards or involved in the transition team. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on tech's efforts to gain influence in the Trump administration. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** now that we understand the depth of Silicon Valley support for Trump and now that Trump is about to take office, how much sway do we think people like Marc Andreessen, because they were out early and publicly for Trump, will have over him as president? Because so far it feels like it's the tech industry in some of its policy announcements and its donations to Trump's inauguration that have been making the concessions to Trump rather than Trump necessarily making any concessions to Silicon Valley. I **Erin Griffith:** mean, the tech industry right now is jockeying for a lot of influence in the future Trump administration. With Andreessen specifically, two Andreessen Horowitz partners have already been appointed to join the administration. And lots of tech workers are trying to get involved in Doge, which is the Department of Government Efficiency. Its goal is to reduce government spending. You see a new post on social media every day of some prominent tech person heading over to Mar-a to meet and try and get on one of these advisory boards or involved in the transition team. There is a lot of crossover. It kind of reminds me of the Obama administration a little bit when you had all these people from Apple, Airbnb, Facebook, kind of a rotating door in and out of that administration. That's now happening in the transition. Fascinating. Yeah, it's been fascinating to see. It's, you know, different people, obviously, from different sides of the aisle. But yeah, there's a lot of enthusiasm among certain groups in the tech industry to seize this opportunity and, you know, get to influence what they see as a whole new regulatory regime. --- ### [The Changing Landscape of Tech Regulation](https://share.snipd.com/snip/7e4adfcc-7d11-4a61-9e8d-404595e8c2c9) 🎧 28:27 - 31:40 (03:12) <iframe src="https://share.snipd.com/embed/obsidian-player/snip/5b39a28f-8734-4211-8f3d-5a24469e707e" width="100%" height="100" style="border: none; border-radius: 12px;" sandbox="allow-scripts allow-same-origin allow-forms allow-popups allow-clipboard-write" ></iframe> - Andreessen's desire for a return to a less regulated tech environment may not be realistic given the industry's current size and power. - The need for government oversight stems from tech's impact on various aspects of society, from antitrust concerns to the risks of AI and crypto. #### 💬 Quote > But right now, that is not the vibe that is coursing around Silicon Valley. The vibe is that this is a time to put our foot on the gas. > — Erin Griffith Erin Griffith on the prevailing sentiment in Silicon Valley regarding regulation. #### 📚 Transcript **Michael Barbaro:** You know, it strikes me, Aaron, that Andreessen's animating premise here and really the heart of his political evolution is his belief that this deal he articulated makes sense, still makes sense. But the reality, I think, for many is that the deal he wants to bring back, the one he felt Biden walked away from, the one he thinks Trump will honor, was from a different era, right? When tech was small, it was the underdog. You could argue it needed a long leash to grow and thrive. But that's not the story of tech now. It is huge and hugely powerful. It affects all of us. In many cases, for good and many for bad. Take kids' social media or the anti-competitive behavior of tech giants that's laid out in federal antitrust lawsuits. Or take the risks of artificial intelligence or crypto. We watch the biggest crypto exchange explode and billions of dollars just disappear. And therefore, many would argue, tech does require some kind of meaningful government oversight. And so what he's asking for seems to be a world where the government's approach to tech, the deal, no longer really matches what tech is today. And yet what he seems want from Trump and people like Andreessen seem to want from this administration is a world where the terms of this deal don't change, even though the industry quite obviously has. Yeah, **Erin Griffith:** exactly. The tech industry has amassed so much power and influence over the last 10, 20 years, and they love that power. But, you know, there's a lot of accountability, responsibility that comes along with that. And there's been some trust lost along the way. So none of this regulatory stuff, none of this criticism has come out of nowhere. There are plenty of people that believe that big tech power is stifling innovation. That's why we need antitrust enforcement. There's a strong case to be made that a lot of these emerging technologies like AI and crypto can cause real harms. And that's why they need to be regulated. But right now, that is not the vibe that is coursing around Silicon Valley. The vibe is that this is a time to put our foot on the gas. One thing that Andreessen said that really struck me, he had a quote that it felt like a boot off the throat for the tech industry the day that Trump was elected. Wow, that's vivid. Yeah. And so that sentiment, while a little dramatic, is of shared amongst the Trump-supporting techies. You know, just to be clear, like, nothing has happened yet, and Trump is unpredictable. So who knows how this is actually going to shake out. But that's the sentiment in this world, that for years they supported Democrats, and what they got in return was criticism and attacks. That's the view. They were vilified. And **Michael Barbaro:** regulated. Yes, **Erin Griffith:** exactly. And now they feel like they're going to get what they want, which is a lack of regulation, a lack of criticism, and in their minds, free reign to innovate at **Michael Barbaro:** will. Well, Erin, thank you very much. We appreciate --- Created with [Snipd](https://www.snipd.com) | Highlight & Take Notes from Podcasts